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Thread: Who or what is JZB?

  1. #1
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    Default Who or what is JZB?

    I think Barrons is Draghar... not only Draghar Druid trained, but all or part Draghar.

    Just as KMM used Norse legend for Berserkers, I think she again was inspired by Norse in creating her Draghar, using both of these as sources:

    1. Draugr: Old Norse for "dragon", a winged serpent.
    2. Draugr (plural Draugar: Undead creature in Norse mythology.
    a. Literally means "spirit who guards the burial mound (barrow) of a king", jealously guards treasures; the body, not just soul, of the dead;, does not decompose/corrupt; contains alter ego of deceased, his representative, retains his character, i.e. if good/kind in life, remains so as draugr in pre-Christian belief (from Viktor Rydberg's "Teutonic Mythology" p.742) *
    b. Able to leave dwelling place (barrow) and visit the living during the night, often ending in death of one or more living creatures.
    c. Can increase their size at will, size being an expression of its vast strength.
    d. Immune to usual weapons, can only be defeated by Hero in hand-to-hand combat; almost impossible to kill, may come back (likens it to vampires in legend).
    e. Move magically through earth, swims through solid stone.
    f. At times, exhibit powers of a magical nature, possess knowledge of the future, can control weather, shape-shift.
    g. Believed to long for the things of life, envy those yet alive.

    http://knowledgerush.com/kr/encyclop...uropean_dragon
    * Rydberg link too long. Google "draugr thrainn"; link starts with http://nsl-archiv.com/Buecher... ; enter "draugr" in in-site search
    http://www.vikinganswerlady.com/ghosts.shtml
    http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Draugr
    http://www.orkneyjar.com/folklore/trows/draugr.htm
    http://economicexpert.com/a/Draugr.html

    All traits listed above tie to Barrons in some way:
    1. Serpent/snake references to JB by Mac, winged serpent tattoo on Draghar Druids/followers (DH), Druids using dark magic.
    2a. JB guards treasures (relics) and treasures his belongings (Persian rug).
    b. Usually out at night, often returns with blood on him.
    c. Mac frequently mentions his taking up more space than he should.
    d. JB's speeches re killing man who broke him "with my bare hands", and about difficulty of killing vampires, other creatures "impossible to kill" (DF).
    e. At O'Bannion's vault door (DF) JB's "I'm a good swimmer" could hint at swimming through walls, not only water; says he could "continue swimmingly" without her; he defies laws of physics.
    f. JB's "I know everything" statement implies he's training/preparing Mac for future he knows she must face; fog is weather control; his sudden appearances defy laws of physics.
    g. JB's reaction to birthday cake, his reactions to blood, interest in Mac's neck (though that could be plain lust) all could indicate envy of the living.

    February's Teaser, "I was mighty.. They didn't recognize me.. I would remind them": Draghar were destroyed, some Druids scatterred, but Fae Court may not know Draghar had learned secrets of draugr-immortality. Or this scene took place long, long ago and JB was not recognized as threat (his powers not stolen). He could have been one of the Druids who were scattered and turned Draghar/draugr later; or he was rescued by 'V'lane's Princess'; or JB is Draghar/human hybrid.

    JB's curse may be his immortality (degree of undead?). I agree with whoever suggested JB could be long-dead Keltar, either forgotten or stricken from family records as Cian was -- another reason to feel cursed -- all Draghar were considered 'damned'. Several phrases from Keltar couples reappear between JB+Mac, and it would make a tidy wrap-up to the combined series.

    So, putting all my eggs in this basket, my theory is:
    1. Barrons is Draghar.
    a. Exact connection to draugr (dragon/undead) unknown yet, but exists.
    b. Draghar gained immortality, with unfortunate side-effects of undeadness.
    2. Barrons is guarding the barrow of royalty (King or Queen) and royal treasures (Fae relics).
    a. BBB is the bastion(projecting part of a fortification or stronghold) over the barrow and vault.
    3. Barrons, one of "the ancient ones", has returned to reclaim what TDD had stolen from them -- maybe powers, but also Druids' good name, right to exist.
    a. With Fae rulers incapacitated, balance of power has shifted, so "might makes right" is truer than ever. Long ago, Fae had the 'might' -- now, maybe not. This also explains the enmity between JB and V'lane: Draghar vs. Fae.
    b. Mac is at fulcrum of at least 3-way power struggle. Mac is epic, a powerful weapon.
    c. Source and extent of her abilities is unknown to her and us, not so unknown to JB and V'lane. (Known to LM? Rowena?) No wonder they all want to harness her powers to increase their faction's 'might'.
    4. Barrons kills when necessary, out of mercy and with honor.
    5. Barrons says he will never let Mac die. If she dies or is too near death to recover, JB will turn her Draghar/draugr as he is -- maybe not the HEA the way we wanted, but a HEA for Mac+Barrons just the same.
    6. Draghar/draugr are related and superior to Hunters; were betrayed by Hunters when Hunters sided (as mercenaries) with TDD against Draghar long ago.

    I could be wrong. But until theory disproved, I see definite connections between Barrons/Draghar/draugr. (Also strong connection between Barrons/Keltars, but that ventures into 'who', not the 'what' addressed here.)
    Comments welcome. (I have chocolate, so am prepared for anything.)
    Last edited by oxymoron; 03-28-2009 at 04:11 PM.

  2. #1011
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    Quote Originally Posted by aprilssix View Post
    I think you may be on to something! I like the way your idea is runing!
    Thanks! My brain comes up with some outlandish theories now and then. I figure the Shades don't like Barrons either because he doesn't taste good or because he isn't living. I prefer to think of him as "too salty" rather than "walking dead".

    Did I mention I like salty snacks?

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    Arrow More thinking on shades-shadows

    Quote Originally Posted by kukana-malia View Post
    Your idea gave me one too.

    After the shades consume a human, they leave behind a husk. Mac believes it to be the part of a human that is distasteful to the Shades. Whatever this part is, maybe Barrons is mostly that, so the Shades don't want to eat him. Following this thought, then the question is, what part of a human is the husk. Mac was thinking hair, bones, something like that, but what if it is something like their soul.

    IDK, what do you think?
    I did a look up on shades...shadows

    http://www.thefreedictionary.com/shadow

    A mirrored image or reflection.
    A phantom; a ghost.
    To cast a shadow on; shade
    To follow, especially in secret; trail

    Shades and shadows are all threw the Fever series. Where do they come from? What if hey are from the cursed silvers? Reflections left behind of a immage? The shadow of what was reflected?

    In the Bloodrush book, the journal entry....

    "I fallowed him again today, feeling like a judas the while time.......................................I fallowed, slinking form one alcove to the next...................But today--unlike the other morning i tailed him---"

    What if the shades/shadows are cursed bits and pieces of poeples reflections in the cursed silvers?

    Could Barrons 8 be "reflections" of him?

    Mirror inages or reflections would not have what a human has, soul, heart, ect.....just a cast shadow of themselves.

    Sorta like Uk "pouring" his darness into the BOOk. What part of him was the darkness, is shadow, shade, what?

    Somewhere in the mist o' time
    a Fever rages in a Highlander "mine"~~
    Dual breath in a Druid born
    An Immortal lad of a Keltar lore~~
    Souls of the present meet the soul of past
    No canceling out of the sexy extra large Keltar lad~~
    Two of his kind, one stays behind
    in the past and in a present kin~~
    I'm trying to find A missing Keltar "Mine"
    Oh Dageus wherefor are though my friend?

  4. #1013
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    Nice theories.

    I just have a few comments. The Omega isn't the second, that would be the Beta. Omega is the last letter in the Greek alphabet and in a wolf pack is the weakest, worst, or scapegoat of the pack. This would go along with how much Barrons seems to dispise himself.

    I like the shade theory, but I've always thought that the shades were the shadows of the Unseelie. In Darkfever it's mentioned when Mac is in the warehouse that the Unseelie cast no shadows on the ground. Perhaps they achieved lives of their own? Hence, why the shades devour life, because they don't have one, just a sort of jesture of a life. Or maybe to kill a shade you have to kill its 'owner'. Allmost makes you wonder going with this train of thought who's shadow it is outside the bookstore.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasonie View Post
    Nice theories.
    I like the shade theory, but I've always thought that the shades were the shadows of the Unseelie. In Darkfever it's mentioned when Mac is in the warehouse that the Unseelie cast no shadows on the ground. Perhaps they achieved lives of their own? Hence, why the shades devour life, because they don't have one, just a sort of jesture of a life. Or maybe to kill a shade you have to kill its 'owner'. Allmost makes you wonder going with this train of thought who's shadow it is outside the bookstore.
    OMG! That is just what i was thinking about the shades! Thanks for your post!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasonie View Post
    Nice theories.

    I just have a few comments. The Omega isn't the second, that would be the Beta. Omega is the last letter in the Greek alphabet and in a wolf pack is the weakest, worst, or scapegoat of the pack. This would go along with how much Barrons seems to dispise himself.

    I like the shade theory, but I've always thought that the shades were the shadows of the Unseelie. In Darkfever it's mentioned when Mac is in the warehouse that the Unseelie cast no shadows on the ground. Perhaps they achieved lives of their own? Hence, why the shades devour life, because they don't have one, just a sort of jesture of a life. Or maybe to kill a shade you have to kill its 'owner'. Allmost makes you wonder going with this train of thought who's shadow it is outside the bookstore.


    I took the Omega significance as Barrens being "death" and death is the "last thing" one experiences. But who knows lol

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    "She couldn't possibly be a null. They're mythical"

    "So you say, as are many things, aren't they Jericho"

    I always thought the mythical reference was to the book, but what if she's referring to Barrons? That he's mythical?

    What would that make him?

  8. #1017
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    Quote Originally Posted by cynfever View Post
    "She couldn't possibly be a null. They're mythical"

    "So you say, as are many things, aren't they Jericho"

    I always thought the mythical reference was to the book, but what if she's referring to Barrons? That he's mythical?

    What would that make him?
    A pheonix! dies, turns to ashes, is reborn after 3 days.

    Barrons, "Never think something is dead unless you stir the ashes and return in 3 days to see if it is still dead".

    A pheonix is reborn, over and over and over again......Like a curse, you never truely die....

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    Quote Originally Posted by aprilssix View Post
    A pheonix! dies, turns to ashes, is reborn after 3 days.

    Barrons, "Never think something is dead unless you stir the ashes and return in 3 days to see if it is still dead".

    A pheonix is reborn, over and over and over again......Like a curse, you never truely die....
    From Ancient Egypt the Mythology

    At the time of the Pyramid Texts, Atum became identified with Re. As Atum-Re, he was connected to the Bennu bird (the phoenix).

    From wikipedia...

    The Bennu was considered the ďsoulĒ of the god Atum,

    From New World Encyclopedia

    In ancient Egypt, Atum (alternatively spelled Tem, Temu, Tum, and Atem) was one of the early gods of Egyptian mythology, associated with creation and the Ennead (nine deities) of Heliopolis. With a name whose etymology denotes "completion" or "ultimacy,"[1] Atum was thought to represent both the self-engendering origin of the cosmos as well as the setting sun.

    Though he was eventually displaced by other solar/creator deities (including Ra and Amun), he remained an important part of the Egyptian mythic corpus (in general) and the royal cult (in specific).

    In the archaic Egyptian pantheon, Atum was the chief god in the Ennead (nine deities) of Heliopolis (the capital of the Lower Kingdom).

    Atum's creative nature has two sides to it, however, because Atum can be seen as the one who completes everything and finishes everything. In this sense he is the uncreator as well as the creator. Thus, in the Book of the Dead, Atum states that at the end of the world he will destroy everything that he has made and return to the form of the primeval serpent (BD 175).[19]

    In later, more nuanced understandings, the god was seen to represent the nexus between earth and sun, by personifying the solar disc in the process of rising and setting. The separateness of these two instances led to a commensurate division of Atum, with the rising sun coming to be seen as a youthful version of the god (named either Nefertum (literally meaning young Atum or Khepri), and the setting sun becoming an elderly version of the god.[21] samhain/beltane?? JZB's bd & mac's BD?



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    Quote Originally Posted by ksushanchik View Post
    Hey Jenny, I totally agree with you..I posted my thoughts in Cruce- revisited thread.. but i think i should move it here betta ..:))


    Hi guy, I love your brainstorming and very interesting theories on the subject. I totally support some of your arguments here. I was thinking about Fever mysteries for a while and decided to share my thoughts here with you. I believe that Barrons and Cruce is the same person.



    Barrons, The Dark King and Cruce are all connected somehow and KMM gives us very little information on them but many clues. When I read the books for the first time I thought, surely our strong, mighty and mysterious Barrons must be the UK. But something doesnít add up. So I was putting facts together to look at it from different angle.


    Cruce and Dark King


    * Are connected somehow, they are in love with the same mortal woman and both want power in their world.


    Other facts


    * Barrons can kill fae, even dark princes are afraid more of him than of Daniís sword
    * Barrons knows everything that there is to know about the mirrors and uses them to move around
    * Shades are afraid of him, super strong, super fast, super powerful, etc etc etc.
    * KMM once mentioned that itís not important who Macís real father is but itís really important who her grandfather is.

    What is Mac?

    * There are demons in her and something so awful that she is afraid even to look at it, dark lake that she mentions is in her head and she is scared to draw power from it.
    * There is unusual strength and potential that she is still to discover and realize ( she walks through wards, learns ďvoiceĒ in mere weeks, etc)
    * The dreams Mac is having that she believes to be generic memories of her ancestors.
    * "An unwanted inheritance of ancient blood"
    * The Dark book seeks her and calls Mac KINDRED
    *Have you noticed how Unseelie Hallows are reacting to Mac's presence?? ( the stones glow and shimmer and so is the Amulet when she is near it...well and the Dark book hunts her and calls her Kindred)



    The obvious answer for me is that both the Book and Mac are created by the same person, the Dark King. She is the descendant, granddaughter of the UK and his beloved concubine, woman we know under name Patrona. The woman that killed herself by falling out of the mirror, as it is mentioned in the book as far as I remember. She found the way into mortal world and gave birth to Isla, Macís real mother.


    Letís get back to the Dark King and Cruce


    * They both are after power and concubine
    * They are the Alpha and Omega and ,as Ryodan mentioned ones, Barrons is always, ever ( or constant) the Omega, the second one
    * As we know the UK went from dark to darker and created the Dark book
    * Cruce went from dark to darker as well and I believe he learned the dark magic that enabled him to curse Kingís mirrors ( to fight the King and get the woman he loved)


    And thatís why he says his famous phrase about willingness to go dark is a virtue.


    Hence, ever the Omega, always the second one needs the Dark book to finish off what he started and defeat the Alpha, the Dark King. And this is where Mac plays her role. But he doesnít seem to know what she is. I wonder if he actually does...



    Additionally,

    *in the last part of Drmfvr Mac and Christian are having conversation about how Christian got lost in Silvers and been stuck in there for over 2 months he got very suspicious about Barrons being able to find the way out in 4 days only. In Silvers, that even Seelie are not using because they are afraid of Cruce's curse. Barrons does not confess to Mac where he was till " four days after"..he says: " its complicated " ..I think its because she would get suspicious about It and could guess the truth about him..


    * If you remember that auction Barrons took Mac with in Bloodfever, everybody seems to think that amulet is actually The Amulet of Cruce ( even Darroc who gets it later), but Barrons seems very confident that the Amulet on the auction is actually one of the Unseelie Hallows.


    * Barrons cannot be the UK because the Unseelie king is unable to move trough mirrors after they were cursed. It spits him out back to his fortress.. hmmmm ..sooo..



    =>So what you guys think??? :) Sorry, if my msg is too long :)

    I totaly agree, I posted my thoughts like that in Cruces thread too, one thing i want to add is that Christain nsaid that UK cant use the silvers because of the curse and we know that Barrons can.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tleonard622 View Post
    I totaly agree, I posted my thoughts like that in Cruces thread too, one thing i want to add is that Christain nsaid that UK cant use the silvers because of the curse and we know that Barrons can.
    Yep! He certainly can use the silvers that the UK cannot
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